Christian hints in anime? Have I been imagining things...?

[A_KOJI_FREAK]

I dunno... but lately I have picked up random hints here and there of some christianity in anime... for instance:

Digimon Frontier (yes I watch Digimon...and not ashamed!):
Lucemon brought peace to the fighting in the digital world but soon became corupt with his own power. The Legendary Warriors sealed Lucemon away in the "Dark Area." Lucemon would come back though, and begin his reign of terror over the Digital world. But only when the time was right...

Does this remind you of the Lucifer thing? It did me... I dunno... Sure they're some twists and stoof but... still... O_o

And another...:
Digimon Adventure 02:
In a shopping scene song off of one of the sound tracks, it features Ken and Daisuke shopping for their families and their friends. I'll post some of the lyrics here... if they're translated correctly then you gatta admit this is a tad odd...

D: Well, anyway, Christmas is great...
K: Yeah.
D: There's lots of good food...
K: Uhuh...
D: And cake too...
K: Yeah.
D: And you get presents...
K: Uhuh...
D: School's on vacation...
K: Well...
D: And New Years comes right after...
K: Um...
D: Nothing but good stuff. Yeah man, it would be the best if it were Christmas all year-round.
K: {Sigh} What are you taking about Daisuke?
D: Huh?
K: Listen, the thing about Christmas is that it's one of the most important
days in the world.
D: Uhuh...
K: It was the day the Savior was born. So, you go to church and pray...
D: Cool!
K: Of course, you knew all of that right?
D: If you say so, baby. It's Christmas!

Oddness...

Alright, so tell me right now if I'm imagining things and going crazy but I seriously, have been seeing this stuff and more... O_o

[Ashley]

moved to the proper forum.

[termyt]

The song lyrics are interesting. There certainly are more and more hints of Christianity taking root in Japanese culture.

[Momo-P]

Oh yes. Digimon has A LOT of Christian based things.

For example, when Lucemon becomes corrupt and evil, his newer forms are entitled "Satan mode" or something like that. Or at least in the Japanese version I recall that being true.

Then you have a few more refrences to the devil in Tamers and Adventure.

Adventure-- When Vamdemon is about to come back, Gennai warns them it will take place during the hour of the beast, 666.

Tamers-- Impmon makes a deal with the dog deva so he gain power and become stronger. This power causes him to evolve in Beelzebumon, where he ends up being the first digimon to ever [spoiler]kill a partner to the chosen children.[/spoiler]

Then there are the more positive Christian refrences, like Hikari being associated with light and angels, and out of all the kids how she really seems to value life and being kind. Heck, her first theme song for the series is called " Holy Light "...almost makes you wonder if someone working on the show was a Christian themself. Would be pretty cool if it were true. ^^

Also these are manga hints, but in the story Guru Guru Pon-chan, Ponta asks what Christmas is, and they actually come out and say it's the birth of Jesus Christ. Really surprised me when I saw that. Then in Mermaid Melody Pichi Pichi Pitch, when Lucia and the others have to fight on Christmas Eve, her opening speech goes as so- " On this holy night, for tearing apart a mother and her child, I cannot forgive you! "

It's true that those two things may not seem like such a big deal, but considering how Japan focuses on Christmas as a romantic holiday more than anything else, well...it IS big.

[GrubbTheFragger]

another anime i noticed alot of christian themes in is Trigun. it is everywhere in that series

[RedMage]

Then you have the "Heaven's Day" episode of Big O. After the incident, nobody remembers what the holiday is about...or at least most people don't.

Alex Rosewater: "You know why we celebrate Heaven's Day, don't you? It's the day God's son was born."

Of course, Alex has that whole God-complex thing going...

[TallasLint]

Nausicaa seems to have Christian symbolism, although I believe Miyazaki commented that it was unintentional.

Also Haibane Renmei has many christian themes, like being "sin bound" and how they can't free themselves from their sin.

[ChristianKitsune]

hmm interesting points.

I hope it were all as pure as you guys say..and maybe it is...lol...

Does anyone think maybe FMA has some christian elements in it?

[spoiler] I mean at the beginning of the series Ed seems to really hate God, and even call himself greater, and then later he says he isn't a God...but a mere human... and there are other points later on...[/spoiler]

[GrubbTheFragger]

yea FMA does there was a thread on that a while ago so if u go back in the forums u should find it

[EireWolf]

Christianity has a big influence on society, even if the people it influences are not Christian. The world can't very well ignore the biggest religion on the planet. It seems perfectly natural that you'd see elements of it in any art form.

[Tenshi no Ai]

Also Haibane Renmei has many christian themes, like being "sin bound" and how they can't free themselves from their sin.

I think that if there was one anime that made the best use of a Christiany theme, it would be Haibane. Although it's supposed to be a non-denominational spiritual deal, I still LOVE how the last ep was played out^^

[A_KOJI_FREAK]

Hmm... glad I'm not the only one who's noticed... Everyone else I tell just looks at me like I'm crazy and hop to the next subject... -___-UU

[CrimsonRyu17]

hmm interesting points.

I hope it were all as pure as you guys say..and maybe it is...lol...

Does anyone think maybe FMA has some christian elements in it?



yes, I truely belive FMA has some christain values big time. especially since the homunculi are named after the seven deadly sins, big christain value here people. With Ed not believing there is a god in the beggining, he does change into thinking there is one and that he is a mere human like you said.
Here something else I've heard, sorry if i can't use spioler tags, mine won't work.

But I've heard smeone say that Isumi was talking about the 'old religion'.

And has anyone noticed that there are crosses in some of the grave yards?, like in episode 4 of FMA?

but yeah, there definent christain values in some anime, I agree at that

[Mangafanatic]

Was this a subbed or a dubbed version? If it was dubbed, I figure that was a totaly butchering of original dialogue. Could be wrong, but that would be my gut instinct.

[Ichigo_89]

And has anyone noticed that there are crosses in some of the grave yards?, like in episode 4 of FMA?

There's ALWAYS crosses in graveyards. I don't think that really has to do with wether FMA has christian themes or not.

[A_KOJI_FREAK]

I watch the dub of Digimon because I can never seem to get my hands on the sub, but I have friends who watch the subbed version and they told me on a message board it was basicly the same as I discribed...

And the song lyrics are what I got off of animelyrics.com... I'm guessing they're right or realitivly close...

[Rocketshipper]

If you understand japanese you could translate it for yourself and see if it's acurate ^^

http://www.animelyrics.com/anime/digimon/dtknkc.htm

has the english lyrics and the romanji japanese lyrics. I think the lines mentioning a savior are supposed to be...

"Ii kai, kurisumasu tte iu no wa, gaikoku de wa ichiban taisetsu na hi nan da yo. Haa, haa
Kyuuseishu ga umareta hi to sareterun da
Dakara, kyoukai e itte inori wo sagetaru surun da
"

[That Dude]

Am I allowed to mention Eva? It is ripe with "christian" symbolism...Not much more than symbles though. Nothing moral or anything. Mod's you can erase this if need be.

[A_KOJI_FREAK]

*shrug* I cant translate the lyrics myself so I depended on that website... I wasn't sure if it was accurate (acctually I didn't think it was even right but in case it was I thought I would make mention to it... -__-U)... thanks for clearing that up... it did strike me as a little weird...

So I guess that idea went bye bye, but still... its still a little odd about the other ones... O-oU or at least I think so...

[Bobtheduck]

Was this a subbed or a dubbed version? If it was dubbed, I figure that was a totaly butchering of original dialogue. Could be wrong, but that would be my gut instinct.

The dubbing companies would be more likely to change things to make them more neutral than to talk about Christianity...

Anime makers have no problems with putting catholic characters that are open about their faith... Seeing a protestant evangelical probably will never happen, but a catholic sure... I don't know the specifics on this, I don't watch Digimon...

[Kaligraphic]

I would think that Japanese audiences would be more familiar with Catholicism than with Evangelical Protestantism in any case, simply because of the history. (e.g. Catholic missionaries went to Japan way back in the day, Protestant ones are a far newer phenomenon there.)

[That Dude]

Nearly every referance in anime is about catholicism and not evangelical.

[meboeck]

Digimon has Christian references left and right, so I will just pick one that has not been mentioned yet. In the very beginning, the major major bad guy is Devimon, who is destroyed when Angemon sacrifices himself. But Angemon comes back afterward because Devimon could not truly destroy him. That is probably the most blatant reference to the Easter story I have ever seen in anime.

[Midori]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned Witch Hunter Robin.

And Kenshin. I still like that one storyarc, with the...the...yeah.

[That Dude]

I totally forgot those two...They both do have a lot of christian referances...Not so much in kenshin (the manga) but it has very good morals that go along with christianity.

[Mugendai]

As someone mentioned before, Izumi (Full Metal Alchemist) does indeed mention christianity.


That also isn't the only mentioning of it throughout the story, its also mentioned before when *evil woman* and Rose enter an abandoned church, going below to the Homunculi' hideout. Both times it mentions it as an old religion.

[Fionn Fael]

Yes, I recall that in Fullmetal Alchemist, the people of Lior referred to Rose as "The Holy Mother" after she gave birth(in the dubbed version, that is). I haven't finished the series yet, though, so...

I also noticed the fact that Christianity is only represented by Catholicism. What's the deal with that? It's not a surprise that the Japanese view on Christianity is a little off, too. Their culture is less than 1 percent Christian.

[Sami_jane]

i dont know if anyone has mentioned it yet but Tri-gun has bible verses at the beginning of every show....or at the end. i cant remember its been a while since i last saw it. but wolfwood is also a preacher in it and carries a cross around.

[That Dude]

I don't remember seeing the bible verses in Trigun...Though it has some references to Christianity.

[Lady Macbeth]

I also noticed the fact that Christianity is only represented by Catholicism. What's the deal with that? It's not a surprise that the Japanese view on Christianity is a little off, too. Their culture is less than 1 percent Christian.

It is not soley represented by Catholicism - in fact Hellsing, a series that I'm currently reading, revolves around the clash between Catholicism and Protestantism in the U.K. and Europe. The portrayal is not flattering at all, and early on in the series they highlight the tension between Catholics and Protestants in Ireland. The issue is highlighted by the fact that the Hellsing Organization (named for Abraham Van Helsing, the vampire hunter in Bram Stoker's Dracula) and the Section XIII Iscariot Organization (A bit more obscure - pairing the number 13 with the name of Judas Iscariot) are the two main players. This pits the darker aspects of both the Protestant Church and the Vatican against each other.

This is not, however, unexpected. Japanese contact with missionaries has always, even at its height, been limited and not always correctly conveyed. Missionaries had a difficult time trying to convince a mixed Buddhist and Shinto people to not worship their ancestors, to not accept God and Jesus as "just another god to add into the mix" and to not continue to worship the Emperor, believed to be of divine heritage. It's a confusing message - the indigenous beliefs of Japan were working well for their people, and many of them couldn't understand this idea of "Christianity" and all of the details that went with it. Some, similar to what missionaries encountered in India, China and other polytheistic regions, were glad to say, "Sure, we can include them in our pantheon." They were not, however, willing to give up the gods and spirits they'd known since birth.

A few truly converted to Christianity.

Then, during the Tokugawa Shogunate, Christianity was banned in Japan. One of the main outlets for Westerners and Western influence in Japan at the time was through the missionaries and Christianity - and the Shogunate was determined to drive the outside influence back out of Japan. Those Christians that still lived in Japan were forced to take their religion underground - holding mass in secret, meeting in secret, smuggling Bibles as though they were drugs or black market goods. On the surface streets, rumors began to spread about this now-mysterious underground religion]old[/b]. Note the symbol for Nagasaki (City) and the symbol for Kagoshima (City) - neither is widely used to represent Christianity today, especially in the Western world, but both are historic symbols for Christianity. Nagasaki's symbol represents its strong Christian heritage and Kagoshima's symbol represents the fact that the city is where the first Christian (St. Xavier) landed in Japan.

I had noticed that all of the series that use pentacles have been missed in this thread - again, it's cross cultural influence at work. The Japanese know virtually NOTHING of Wicca or Western conceptions of witchcraft, which the pentacle has come to be associated with - they associate it with Christianity, the same Christianity that carried the pentacle into the Holy Land on their shields during the Crusades and the same pentacle that was in use by King Solomon. The Japanese, by and large, don't realize that the pentacle has fallen out of favor with Christians - that's why Alucard wears it on the back of his gloves and still has the cross on his guns. (Also, MUCH of the Japanese art where the cross is seen worn upside down, especially by the "good guys", is not intended to be offensive. The meaning and significance of the cross was also never correctly conveyed to most Japanese, so they think it's interchangeable, like the Celtic Cross is.)

i dont know if anyone has mentioned it yet but Tri-gun has bible verses at the beginning of every show....or at the end. i cant remember its been a while since i last saw it. but wolfwood is also a preacher in it and carries a cross around.

Trigun is steeped in Christian symbolism and metaphors. Wolfwood's Cross Punisher (if you haven't seen the series entirely, just trust me that it's not a regular old wooden cross he's carrying around) is one such example - it's not only convenient for him to avoid suspicion, since he is a wandering priest, it's also a symbol for the cross he bears daily in his life. That's why the Cross Punisher is so important in that series, all the way to the end. (Those that have seen the end should think on that a bit in relation to how the series ended.)

Vash and Knives are not just weird twins. Their conversations both at the beginning of the series, as children (involving the butterfly and the spider) and at the end as adults, both gives away their identities and gives another look at Christian mythos - particularly in regard to "other than human" beings.

Again, they're not always traditional Western ideas or images (see the much longer post above) but they are certainly present throughout that series.