Need info on X and Cardcaptor Sakura

[Jeikobu]

I am interested in seeing these, but I want to know about their content, especially on a spiritual level. The review for the X movie here sounds like it's really bad, but I heard from Rocketshipper that the series is good, and largely based off the book of Revelations. I also heard there's a Christian in it who's portrayed in a good light. As for Cardcaptor Sakura, I at first dismissed it because I heard the cards were tarot cards, but Rocketshipper said a card's only used to tell the future in one ep, and the cards are more like living creatures that are captured, kind of like Pokemon. I'm just a bit concerned about the level of sorcery and if it's portrayed as good.
Suggestions would be appreciated. Arigatou!

[That Dude]

I have limited knowledge on these but from what I know of X there is a lot of violence and some kinda weird sorcery stuff. It's a really dark series from what I've glanced through...And yes the magic in CCS is portrayed in a mostly good light. Nothing really witchcraft-esque there...It's pretty innocent...A little bit lighter magic than Inuyasha.

[Nate]

As for Cardcaptor Sakura, I at first dismissed it because I heard the cards were tarot cards, but Rocketshipper said a card's only used to tell the future in one ep, and the cards are more like living creatures that are captured, kind of like Pokemon. I'm just a bit concerned about the level of sorcery and if it's portrayed as good.
Suggestions would be appreciated. Arigatou!

Okay, about the "tarot card" thing.

Kero-chan told Sakura she could use them to tell the future, but the farthest they go in the series is when they're chasing down one particular card. They're not sure which one it is, so Sakura uses the cards as a hint, drawing three cards that are related to the one she's trying to catch...giving her a clue as to what card it is.

The cards are kind of like Pokemon, yes. She released the cards and they were given physical forms, so she has to recapture them, so to speak, or else a terrible disaster will befall this world (Kero-chan's words).

As far as the sorcery goes, it's kind of like...Pokemon, honestly. She pulls out the staff, and she strikes the card she wants with it and it releases the creature to fight (at least for creature cards, cards like Shield, Sword, and Fly don't have associated creatures and instead give her special abilities such as a sword, a shield, or wings on her staff so she can fly).

[Rocketshipper]

I was going to PM you my reviews of the spiritual content, but since you started the topic I might as well put it here ^^.

"As I was saying before on IM, the main plot of X is based on elements of Revelations. It's not the entire book mind you, bit it does borrow some imagery and ideas from there and relgion in general. The 7 dragons of heaven, Satsuki's computer "The Beast", the star of David on the hilt of Kamui's sword, the meaning of Kamui's name, the shape of Karen's Spirit shield, the whole "end of the world" storyline, all are religious elements. The 7 Dragons of Heaven fight to save the world, and the 7 Dragons of Earth are trying to destroy it. Each of the Dragons of Heaven has special powers and the ability to create "spirit shields" which are used to protect the city and innocent people from being hurt or killed by the fighting. Each of the dragons also comes from a different religion. Sorata is a buddhist monk and can control lighting, Arashi is a shinto priestess and can summon a sword from her hand, Yuziriha is...some shrine religion and is aided in battle by an Inugami (a dog spirit). Karen is a Christian and has the ability to control fire, Aoki is just some guy who can control wind (I think he might be some specific religion, but I don't think they say what it is), and Subaru is a Omyouji, a japanese exorcist who uses Yin-Yang magic. One of the villians is also an Omyouji. The leader of the dragons of Heaven is a Dream Gazer, she can see the future in her dreams. The main character Kamui has weird psychic powers and is "The one who does God's will" according to the meaning of his name ^_^. Anyway, even though it has a bunch of different characters from different religions I think the ending of the series has an obvious christian meaning, although I wouldn't want to ruin it for you, and I was happy that they didn't look down on Karen's character because of her being a Christian. The story is pretty dark and angsty, but the TV series does have a positive ending. The movie though had a REALLY depressing ending. And who knows how the manga will end. (It's still going. CLAMP hasn't written a new chapter for like 2 years. The last volume released was number 18, out of an estimated 20)

I've always thought of Cardcaptor Sakura as being more fantasy and not really relating that much to real life occult elements. For one thing, her cards aren't really tarot cards or even simply magic cards, but rather they are living creatures. They all have human or animal shaped forms and minds of their own (one of them even gets a crush on her older brother ^^), which is why Sakura has to battle and capture them like Pokemon. Throughout the series Sakura referres to the Cards as her friends and she does what she can to protect them, and they protect her in turn. She does use them in one episode to tell a fortune, but that ability of the cards is never mentioned again for the whole series. I think Kammerite summarized it well. Other characters, however, do use more traditional types of magic. Li uses "Ofudo" charms to help him cast elemental spells. One character, who referrs to himself as a re-incarnation of a wizard who died a long time ago, uses magic to fight Sakura. However, one difference between even this magic and real occult stuff is that in CCS "magic" is considered an inherent ability that you have to be born with. Only certain people can use magic in the CCS story. Finally, it's never stated what, if any, religion Sakura and her family is, but it's clear that they believe in a heaven, because they mention many times throughout the series that Sakura's mother is there. A few episodes also show Sakura's mother as an angel watching over Sakura"

[Jeikobu]

Hmm, that doesn't sound so bad. Thanks for the help! I think I'll have to try both of these.

[CDLviking]

Yes, the tarot thing only occurs once. A few other things to mention as well that I may have also mentioned in the review. The show has a very relativistic view of religion. In a latter Christmas episode, one character is practicing the piano for a Christmas mass, but he says he is playing to express his gratitude to the Earth. The cards are living things, but they were also created by Clow Reed using his own magical power. References are also made to magical powers of the Sun, moon and stars. There are also some same sex attractions in the show. The most obvious one turns out to be nothing and is explained away, but it is still there none the less. I would have no problems with a teen watching it, but you might want to preview it before showing it to younger children.

[Nate]

There are also some same sex attractions in the show. The most obvious one turns out to be nothing and is explained away, but it is still there none the less. I would have no problems with a teen watching it, but you might want to preview it before showing it to younger children.

Oh yeah, forgot to mention that.

Li is attracted to Yukito, but to tell you why would be a spoiler. Suffice to say though, Li is NOT gay, and I should know, having seen the second movie. XD

Tomoyo also seems to be attracted to Sakura, but there is a reason for that too, which I also cannot say as it is a spoiler. XD

Just a little heads up.

[Kaori]

In all due respect, Rocketshipper, I have to disagree with you a bit about X. While it does contain quite a bit of religious symbolism, some of which comes from the Judeo-Christian tradition, I believe that these are used more as artistic motifs than for the actual meaning they convey. Also, the different religions portrayed are seen as being on equal footing--Karen's ability to control fire is not any more effective than Sorata's esoteric Buddhism or Subaru's omyouji powers. Also, there are quite a few occult elements, like the pentegram that both Subaru and Seishiro use, and some references to Kabbalism. (Remember when Satsuki is being tested on her knowledge of the sephirot?)

Also, despite the high degree of religious content in X, I wouldn't say that it is based off of the book Revelation. The idea of the world ending is not exclusive to Christianity. There is one dragon in Revelation, not fourteen of them, and it is unambiguously evil; whereas in X, both sides are dragons--both the good and the evil. Also, you may recall that "Kamui" has a double meaning and can also signify "he who hunts the will of God." There is really nothing in the series that I would say ultimately supports a Christian worldview, unless you count the very fact that Karen is a Christian--but Christianity is placed on the same level as any other religion, which (if you follow ideas to their logical conclusions) is a rather relativistic view of things.

Aside from the occult elements (quite a few of the characters use magic, including spell servants, and one is an exorcist by trade), there are a few other things that could possibly be disturbing. The TV series contains only a few brief instances of non-graphic nudity, and the violence is moderate. The nature of the violence that does occur could be considered objectionable, however--there is at least one crucifixion. In regard to "bad religion" in general, I think this is one of the worse anime/manga that I have seen; if the alternate religions and occultism in X do not bother you, then there is little that ever will.

I wouldn't recommend the X movie for the reason that Rocketshipper mentioned--the ending--as well as the simple fact that it attempts to compress the plot of an entire series into a single movie, which naturally does not do justice to the story. If you are interested in the manga, you should simply be aware that it is less clean than the anime in every aspect--it is much more graphically violent, it has several instances of graphic female nudity, and there are some relationships that could be seen as having yaoi/yori overtones, although they are largely left open to interpretation.

[CDLviking]

Tomoyo also seems to be attracted to Sakura, but there is a reason for that too, which I also cannot say as it is a spoiler. XD

Just a little heads up.

What Tomoyo's feelings for Sakura amount to are never really stated, but one could very easily come to that conclusion. There is at least one other possibly disturbing relationship in the show, and it is not played down at the end like Li liking Yukito.

[Rocketshipper]

you mean Yukito/Toya, CD?? ^^. I think that relationship is ambigous in the same way Tomoyo/Sakura is. It could be taken either way.

The dragon in Revelations had seven heads though. And the computer being called "The Beast" probably wasn't a coincidence. I think CLAMP specificly said in an interview that they wanted to tell an End of the World story with Christian elements in it. In the other review I did for X on another topic I mentioned that the fact the different religious beliefs are portrayed as being equal could be a probem for some viewers. I thought that it's really not realistic to expect secular writers to portraye any one particular religion as better than another, and I was just really glad that they didn't look down on Christianity in the story. And as I said, I also think the ending to the X TV series has obvious Christian symbolism.

[spoiler] The whole world, and Kamui's best friend Fuma, are only saved after Kamui willingly sacrifices his life. [/spoiler]

I don't know if I'd say the use of the Pentragram in this series was used in an ocult context, the way we think of it. It probably means something different for Omyouji. And I would have put the Sephirot thing under the "borrowed ideas from religion in general" heading in the same areas as the Star of David. I'm not an expert or anything, but I thought the Kabbalah stuff was part of some Jewish traditions or something. Are they considered as more of a cult then?? I wasn't aware of that. But that particular image had like, nothing to do with the plot at all ^^. I wouldn't be surprised if CLAMP was like "Hey, Satsuki needs something to do for her flashback. Maybe she could be studying Gendo Ikari's ceiling!!" And just threw the image in.

[Nate]

Not a minor spoiler, but a spoiler nonetheless about Sakura and Tomoyo:

[SPOILER]Remember, Tomoyo's mom and Sakura's mom were cousins, so Sakura and Tomoyo are related.[/SPOILER]

[Kaori]

The dragon in Revelations had seven heads though. And the computer being called "The Beast" probably wasn't a coincidence. I think CLAMP specificly said in an interview that they wanted to tell an End of the World story with Christian elements in it.

Yes, the Christian elements are certainly there]In the other review I did for X on another topic I mentioned that the fact the different religious beliefs are portrayed as being equal could be a probem for some viewers. I thought that it's really not realistic to expect secular writers to portraye any one particular religion as better than another, and I was just really glad that they didn't look down on Christianity in the story.[/quote]
I do not think that this would be a realistic expectation either. However, the fact that you mention that they are secular writers simply illustrates that their goal is not exactly to endorse Christianity.

And as I said, I also think the ending to the X TV series has obvious Christian symbolism.

I did not disagree with you on this point. Kamui in some ways can be seen as a kind of Messiah figure, although he is a rather flawed and imperfect one.

And I would have put the Sephirot thing under the "borrowed ideas from religion in general" heading in the same areas as the Star of David. I'm not an expert or anything, but I thought the Kabbalah stuff was part of some Jewish traditions or something. Are they considered as more of a cult then??

I am hardly a Kabbalah expert, but the teachings are secret, esoteric, and mystical. They are based on Rabbinic teachings but not to be confused with orthodox Judaism.

[CDLviking]

You could probably think of Kabbalah as a Jewish form of Gnosticism. The Xenosaga games have Kabbalah elements in the plot and such if you are familiar with them.

I think the Toya/Yukito relationship is less ambiguous, but still doesn't necessarily have to be interpreted in a negative context (though I don't think finding a positive interpretation is a bit of a stretch).

[Alice]

Just my two cents, but I've stopped reading these Clamp titles, both of which I loved. I just had to stop. The magic stuff finally got to me, but even more than that the shonen ai/yaoi stuff in it. (Not that there was anything graphic, but the overtones were there, always there, and the feelings and ideas. Which, perhaps even worse than the really graphic stuff, idealizes this stuff, and makes it seem okay and sweet and marvelous... And if you think about it, Sakura was aimed at kids.)

So that is why I never read either of these Clamp titles anymore... as much as I loved the art, and liked the characters. I will probably always love Clamp's art, but I don't think I will ever be able to read them again... at least not with these overtones continuing.

[CDLviking]

(Not that there was anything graphic, but the overtones were there, always there, and the feelings and ideas. Which, perhaps even worse than the really graphic stuff, idealizes this stuff, and makes it seem okay and sweet and marvelous... And if you think about it, Sakura was aimed at kids.)

That's probably what disturbs me the most. The young target audience might be unable to properly understand relationships and come to view them as just as acceptable as any other relationship. I must stress the importance that if younger siblings are to watch this show, they must already understand that homosexuality is wrong and why.

[SquareEnixGamR]

wouldnt worry too much about what the movie contains more of what YOU ,yourself get out of it. if your faith is strong, then you should be able to take it purely for what it is-fictional entertainment. im sure God knows your not planning on actually using tarot cards yourself ^^.

[Jeikobu]

True, but you should still set boundaries on what you watch.