Super Smash Brothers Brawl

[Fish and Chips]

ZE WARUDO!

[Haruhiko]

Wolf has been 100% confirmed.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0H6uRcUADi8

Fox clone my left foot!

[Debitt]

Video 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=FeeIYr5wW78

[spoiler]Okay, so what was this about the no-clones business?

From what I saw in the video, Toon Link's moveset is nigh identical to Young Link's. D-B for bombs? Check. N-B for arrows? Check. U-B for spin? Check. S-B for boomerang? Check, check, and check. Even the u-air and d-air are the same.

Now, granted, I don't main Young Link or Link, so for all I know Toon Link's dynamics could be different from his non-cell-shaded counterpart. But, uh, right now? I'm skeptical and am trying rather hard not to call the kid a superfluous addition.

EDIT: Wolf is looking pretty clone-tastic, too. To the point that, if it weren't for his voice and the announcer, I'd be tempted to say 'MIGHTY FAKE'. I hope they give Falco a new moveset, because the last thing anyone needs is three Space Animals.[/spoiler]

[Haruhiko]

[spoiler]Okay, so what was this about the no-clones business?

From what I saw in the video, Toon Link's moveset is nigh identical to Young Link's. D-B for bombs? Check. N-B for arrows? Check. U-B for spin? Check. S-B for boomerang? Check, check, and check. Even the u-air and d-air are the same.

Now, granted, I don't main Young Link or Link, so for all I know Toon Link's dynamics could be different from his non-cell-shaded counterpart. But, uh, right now? I'm skeptical and am trying rather hard not to call the kid a superfluous addition.

EDIT: Wolf is looking pretty clone-tastic, too. To the point that, if it weren't for his voice and the announcer, I'd be tempted to say 'MIGHTY FAKE'. I hope they give Falco a new moveset, because the last thing anyone needs is three Space Animals.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]I do agree with you 100%]

[Debitt]

[spoiler]I do agree with you 100% with Young Link. There is no reason his spot couldn't have been taken by a more worthwhile character. That was laziness on Sakurai's part.

However, I completely disagree with your Wolf statement. Wolf has a different B, a different B^, different A attacks, and the like. About the only thing similar between him and Fox are their Final Smashes, which are the absolute same thing, but that can be excused, as Wolf will be a much different character than Fox, that can be assured. I'm not that sure on Falco, yet. Falco has dual-blasters, so I'm questioning what they'll do with that, and his reflector-thing can be thrown like a yo-yo, as you can see in one of those videos on YouTube. I'll try to find it if I can.

I think the StarFox additions are great, as I personally love the series and characters (its kinda' hard not to. I own each StarFox game ever produced, excluding that tournament-thing for the SNES) and I can't wait to try them out.[/spoiler]

[spoiler]o-o Different A attacks? Really? xD]

[Alexander]

[spoiler]

I don't know what it says, but something tells me the folks in the land of the rising sun aren't too happy with Wolf either. And I am as well.

I can forgive a clone, as I usually only have a grand total of 3 characters that I'm really good with, but this has crossed the line a bit for me. Two clones is one too many.

If Wolf is the last character to unlock as well, then that will be a real blow for me. Especially compared to the "wow" effect G&W had in Melee.

I'll still love this game to death, no doubt about it, but this is the first real disappointment for me.[/spoiler]

[mastersquirrel]

While I will hold my judgement on the Brawl characters until I have played the game thoroughly, I must disagree with the people who find the "clone characters" useless or simply a case of the developers being lazy.

In melee I remember distinctly when I started playing Falco seriously and found out how different my tactics were with him than when I played as Fox. Sure some if not many of his attacks were the same animation-wise, but almost every one of those recycled moves affected the target differently whether it be stunning an opponent with the blaster or the reflecter shield knocking a person upward instead of forward (which went well with his insane jump).

You can find these things apparent in every "clone character" if you actually look and you just might find that they're more different than their counterparts than you originally expected.

*Goes back to programming*

[Debitt]

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm fully aware of the differences between the clones. There's a reason I play Pichu rather than Pikachu, after all. You're still learning a new character. My own personal disappointment lies in the fact that I was looking forward having every character has their own, distinct moveset, as opposed to 'oh, the reflector sends them up instead of sideways!'

Obviously they're not just copy-pasta'ing the programming verbatim in those cases, but the similarities still seem a bit uncreative. I recognize that they're probably retooling former clones, like Falco and Ganondorf, but I still can't help but feel like Nintendo's missing the boat here, especially with Toon Link.

[mastersquirrel]

As previously stated: "I will hold my judgement on the Brawl characters until I have played the game thoroughly...", but I can see where you're coming from.

[SPOILER]The thing I'm most disappointed in is that you don't get to see someone good playing as Toon Link. Seriously, the guy had trouble with the first match of Classic set on Normal. I wanted to see what Toon Link could really do, specifically his Final Smash.[/SPOILER]

[Cognitive Gear]

[SPOILER]The thing I'm most disappointed in is that you don't get to see someone good playing as Toon Link. Seriously, the guy had trouble with the first match of Classic set on Normal. I wanted to see what Toon Link could really do, specifically his Final Smash.[/SPOILER]

[spoiler]While I'm very happy to see that Toon Link is similar to Young link (Who was my main in friendly-competitive matches), I can't believe there are now two clones of one character. When I first heard that Wolf would be in Brawl, I hoped he would contain his own moveset, something distinctly more sinister than Fox or his original clone.

It's too bad, really. They've spent so much time on xtras when they could have been creating truly new characters.[/spoiler]

[KeybladeWarrior]

I am still anticipating this game despite the mild faults.

[Felix]

[Spoiler]*sigh* Honestly I'm disappointed as well. Not that I dislike wolf as a character. Heaven knows he's a cool guy, but his moveset is awfully similar from what I can tell. There are so, so, soooo many characters that would have been much more worth the time and effort it takes to put a character in the game. If they were going to put a third Starfox character in, a much better choice would have been Krystal, who would have a very distinct fighting style because of her staff, and would bring another female face to a cast dominated by mostly males. I heard that Rare owns Krystal though, so that may be where the complication lies. This is all quite disappointing, especially since it seems like Wolf is the last character to unlock. :/ [/spoiler]

[AsianBlossom]

Hm...it seems as though it would be about noon in Japan right about now...do you all suppose those who are not in school are going Brawl-crazy right about now? XD

And pichu did actually return for Brawl...he's just not pichu anymore. Recognize the little blue goggles as an alternate costume for pikachu? Pichu wore those in Melee.

[Alexander]

Hm...it seems as though it would be about noon in Japan right about now...do you all suppose those who are not in school are going Brawl-crazy right about now? XD

Um...YES?

I'm currently running around like a crazed school girl screaming "ZERO SUIT SAMUS CAN BE PLAYED WITHOUT NEEDING A SMASH BALLLLL!!!!!!!!!!111"

And yes, it's true. GoNintendo confirms it.

Egads, some people are really unhappy about [spoiler]Wolf[/spoiler]

Someone told me he would rather have Torgo as the last character.



It MIGHT just work if enough raving fans demand it. XD

[Nate]

So now we have three of the same character. Woohoo.

Also, out of curiosity, how will Zero Suit Samus be played without a Smash Ball? I saw that for Pokemon Trainer and Zelda/Shiek, when you select the character there's an extra selection that allows you to choose who you start out with, but I didn't see one for Samus.

[meboeck]

Also, out of curiosity, how will Zero Suit Samus be played without a Smash Ball? I saw that for Pokemon Trainer and Zelda/Shiek, when you select the character there's an extra selection that allows you to choose who you start out with, but I didn't see one for Samus.

I believe you eventually earn that same ability for her through SSE.

As a side note, Dojo has announced that now that Brawl is out in Japan, they will turn the site from a preview site to a guide site, which means they will be giving information on hidden characters, stages, etc.

[Haruhiko]

[Spoiler]*sigh* Honestly I'm disappointed as well. Not that I dislike wolf as a character. Heaven knows he's a cool guy, but his moveset is awfully similar from what I can tell. There are so, so, soooo many characters that would have been much more worth the time and effort it takes to put a character in the game. If they were going to put a third Starfox character in, a much better choice would have been Krystal, who would have a very distinct fighting style because of her staff, and would bring another female face to a cast dominated by mostly males. I heard that Rare owns Krystal though, so that may be where the complication lies. This is all quite disappointing, especially since it seems like Wolf is the last character to unlock. :/ [/spoiler]

[spoiler]Well, Wolf technically isn't the last one you get. Since the method hasn't been revealed how to unlock him, then its rather unlikely that he was supposed to be the final character. The final character your supposed to get in SSE is Sonic, and I think that he was to be the final character.

*shrugs* I don't know, we'll see.[/spoiler]

[Haruhiko]

Fox gameplay compared to Falco gameplay.

[AsianBlossom]

There's an article I was reading on wii.ign, and it had a couple of pictures, like registers set up in this one store in Akihabara JUST for those who wanted to buy Brawl.

And yes, Alec-kun, I knew they'd be going crazy.

Heck, just after seeing a video today of the IGN people playing the SSE boss battle [spoiler]against Rayquaza[/spoiler] even I'm starting to become anxious. Why can't March come sooner?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

*falls over*

(And on a completely unrelated side note, it's been confirmed today that I am a geek...or at least just weird. As my mom and I were leaving a friend's house, I noticed through someone's porch window that they were playing Metroid Prime 3, and I was all, "Oh, mom, look! It's so cool! They're playing Metroid Prime 3!" and my mom was like, "What? How do you know that?" XD)

[Nate]

Actually, not all characters are unlocked via SSE, so there really isn't a "last" character, it all depends on what you play first. Also from what I hear Sonic is one of the characters you don't unlock through SSE, along with Jigglypuff.

Also, I dedicate this song to Falco and Wolf.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=c_7BaiHmuRs

[Fish and Chips]

Someone told me he would rather have Torgo as the last character.



It MIGHT just work if enough raving fans demand it. XD

He takes care of the stage while the Master Hand is away.

[AsianBlossom]

Whoa, major change on the way the Dojo looks...now it's all "click here if you want spoilers!" XD

Good for those who don't want stuff, you know, SPOILED, but for those of us who have made numerous trips to places like BrawlCentral because of her siblings computer issues, or just because their sibling wanted to share the information, it doesn't really matter whether or not we see the hidden stuff now. Heck, I WANT to see the hidden stuff now, or else I'd be driving myself crazy for about a month or so.

And with school, I don't think I'd want to be driving myself crazy with anything that doesn't apply to my grades or classwork.

[Fish and Chips]

WARNING!

CHALLENGER APPROACHING!



My day has been made.

[Haruhiko]

Actually, not all characters are unlocked via SSE, so there really isn't a "last" character, it all depends on what you play first. Also from what I hear Sonic is one of the characters you don't unlock through SSE, along with Jigglypuff.

Also, I dedicate this song to Falco and Wolf.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=c_7BaiHmuRs

No, Sonic is the last character you get in the SSE.

[spoiler]At the very end of the game, he comes in and kills that strange TRON-looking dude you can see in some screenshots, and thats where the game ends and you unlock him. The video of it is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZY0B-Iuojc[/spoiler]

[ich1990]

I found a video that shows the final smashes for all the characters, including the secret ones. Watch at your own risk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HU_AJbx10Q

[Raiden no Kishi]

[spoiler]So you can play as R.O.B.? Nice. I guess it'll be the Mr. Game and Watch of this game (the somewhat awkward, quirky gag/retro-homage character)

Speaking of Game & Watch (whom I rather like) . . . that is a crazy Final Smash.

As far as Fox and Wolf go, despite my relative apathy towards the Star Fox series, it bothers me that they're basically clones. I mean, Wolf even gets a re-colored Landmaster for his Final Smash. What would have been interesting is for Wolf to summon a Wolfen and strafe the battlefield two or three times, followed by a bomb (or he just rams the field, ejecting before impact.

On Final Smashes in general, it's nice to see that they're not instant-kill techniques (although, with enemies sufficiently beaten up . . .), but rather high-damage special techniques that add an element of theatricality.

Ike's Final Smash is pretty epic, although Ness and Lucas' seem rather easy to avoid. Luigi's is humorous and interesting (status effect blitz?). Snake's is rather clever, although I didn't know they make moon clips for an MGL. Sonic's and Pikachu's seem to be identical except for minor visual differences. Falco . . . see Wolf comments. Jigglypuff's is funny. I like Ganondorf's, and Marth's is probably my favorite of them all. Mario's is pretty standard hadouken/kamehameha fare. Yoshi's is rather interesting. Peach's, I can see being useful, although Bowser;s seems somewhat clumsy. DK's is humorous and clever, and Diddy's seems difficult to use (which is fine with me since I don't plan on using him at all). Wario's seems useful and appropriately comedic. PKMN Trainer's seems of limited utility, but Pit's seems to work decently well in a "suppression fire" sort of way. Samus' is similar to PKMN Trainer's, but the Zero Suit FS is neat-looking. Meta Knight's seems lazily done, and DeDeDe's is humorous and possibly useful. Link only gets one word: Omnislash (or Renzokuken/Lionheart, if you prefer dark-haired bishies). Zelda's seems to only be useful against a single enemy, and I would have preferred a different FS for Shiek, but I don't know what it would be. Toon Link's is disappointing ~ I would have loved to have seen some offshore bombardment from Tetra and her pirate crew. Ice Climbers' seems useful, as does Olimar's. Cpt. Falcon's is rather neat ~ reminds me of GF Doomtrain from FFVIII. ROB's . . . is interesting. Lucario's is rather neat.[/spoiler]

It looks like I'll have to save my pennies for a Wii and some controllers . . .

.rai//

[Alexander]

Okay, I've let it all out. I feel better now.

[Felix]

XD That even helped me let off a little steam.

Anyway,
[spoiler]I can live with having Falco and Wolf in the game without truly unique movesets, but the fact that they all have the exact same final smash is what really bugs me. Come on Sakurai, I know you can do better than that. I liked Rai's idea of having wolf strafe or ram the field in his wolfen.[/spoiler]

[Mr. SmartyPants]

About Marth, Toon Link, and Ness...

I SO CALLED IT.

And I'm glad to see that they took Roy out. And I'm glad to see all those "Durka durka Marth and Ness are not gonna be in it" get to be quiet.

[Felix]

Spoiler tags, dude.

Though I guess it's pretty much common knowledge now.