Gamecast - Episode 20 - "Everything 3.0"

[Link Antilles]

Better late than never! In this slightly delayed Gamecast, we discuss guidelines for great RPGs, talk about Playstation Home, review the latest Halo news, and respond to your feedback.


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Question to the Audience: What are your guidelines to a great RPG?

[Fish and Chips]

NPC, or Red Mage? If I'd have been a Red Mage from FFIX, I'd have the best of both worlds.

And I'd balk on that Halo 3 legendary edition unless they throw in a working energy sword.

Question to the Audience: What are your guidelines to a great RPG?

I don't have all that much to tack on, you guys pretty much covered all your bases]Final Fantasy Tactics Advance[/I]. More realistic and flexible, particularly for support characters and those of us who highly value our duel-welding White Mage/Ninja hybrids (as I do).

#3 - This is why I shun most MMORPGs. Free roaming? I can do that right here, in real life. For free even. And no invisible barriers or impassible inch-high ledges either.

#4 - Amen. I prefer immersive stories and interesting characters, and equally interesting antagonists. Not necessarily deep or overly complicated plot lines, as there's something to be said for simplicity, but it should draw me in nonetheless.

[Mr. SmartyPants]

Omg shut up. I mixed classes, SO WHAT! LEAVE ME ALONE *cries* Pffffffft, all you people are mean. I wasn't thinking clearly! (Like I ever do?)

Well, I do hate the Job system that's in FF3, 5, and Tactics.

[Nate]

#2 - I'm motioning for a skill-based experience system, a la' Final Fantasy Tactics Advance. More realistic and flexible, particularly for support characters and those of us who highly value our duel-welding White Mage/Ninja hybrids (as I do).

The only reason I didn't like Tactics Advance as much as the original is I hate the idea of learning skills from weapons and armor. It means that you have to equip super weak weapons and armor if you're a novice to the class late in the game, and it means if you're unable to find a specific weapon (like the impossible to obtain Mythril weapons), you can't ever get the ability. I liked the Job Point system much more, it was far superior, IMO.

[Fish and Chips]

The only reason I didn't like Tactics Advance as much as the original is I hate the idea of learning skills from weapons and armor. It means that you have to equip super weak weapons and armor if you're a novice to the class late in the game, and it means if you're unable to find a specific weapon (like the impossible to obtain Mythril weapons), you can't ever get the ability. I liked the Job Point system much more, it was far superior, IMO.

Yeah, annoying how certain desirable skills are locked away in near-impossible to find weapons (I've been waiting for chain-magic since forever). I mentioned FFTA only because I haven't played the original Tactics, though I imagine the experience system is the same.

[uc pseudonym]

Quick thoughts on various subjects...

Classes: Actually, I had in mind more of a Knight-type tank as opposed to a Barbarian (UC smash!). And if I get to pick, I'd be a Knight/Monk tank, mostly because I like the idea. As for the attacking stat, you're all very kind.

Regarding virtual worlds, I find they don't interest me unless they offer some form of advancement. So while getting trophies for games might amuse me for a while, it wouldn't have lasting value. However, if beating a fantasy game gave me a sword trophy that I could carry around my house and use to slash things, I'd be all for it.

Omega Amen: My chance to play God of War 2 immediately has been lost, so you can write a review at your leisure.

RPG Guidelines: For me, the biggest thing about exploration is that I want to feel free to explore a bit without being penalized. That is, I don't want to worry that if I go left instead of right I'll be annihilated by the first monster I see, or somehow miss an entire subquest. Or that if I take a step too far in one direction I'll be caught up in a cutscene and unable to return to the area for half the game.

Related question - what do you think of various techniques of blocking players from going places early in the game? The classic being guards that won't let you through a gate, of course. Is it better for the characters to inexplicably be unable to walk to a certain area (similar to when a map ends without a definitive barrier) or should the game designers invent some obstacle? The latter seems to make for a more "realistic" world, but it can get in the way when the reason you can't enter an area is ridiculous ("I'm sorry, sir, but our religion believes standing in a line and blocking off streets is an act of great devotion").

On a random note, I think it would be interesting to hear the Gamecast discuss the "hardest bosses" thread. The CAA podcast discusses threads, and here we have a gaming one that I think could lead to a quick bit of interesting discussion.

Question to the Audience: What are your guidelines to a great RPG?

Two occur to me:

- The characters in the party should have distinctive roles. Everyone should have skills that make them valuable and are useful for different situations. Or, in the case of games where the characters are completely interchangeable, they should be able to be customized to a variety of useful roles.

- Gaining levels should not simply be a matter of increasing stats or gaining abilities that are direct upgrades of previous ones. Different degrees of customization work for different games, but I would like to be able to develop my characters to some degree instead of merely climbing a preset level path.

[Fish and Chips]

Actually, I had this idea once wherein accomplishing tasks or defeating enemies in an RPG would grant you collective experiance, as opposed to individually distributing experiance. You'd emerge victorious, be awarded, say, +712 exp, which you could then chose how to spend. If one team member is lagging behind, unload it all on him/her. Want to raise specific stats above other ones? Manage where you want them to go, purposefully build up high defensive stats for your support characters, stuff like that.

I'd love an experiance system like that.

[kryptech]

I get my monk on.

Boy, this is the most worked up I've heard Omega since that shout-out to UC at the beginning of a previous Gamecast. It was interesting to hear how accurate the audience's classes were for you guys and why.

I'm afraid I can't add to your RPG suggestions as I have very little experience with RPG...

Do you accept ideas here for future Gamecasts? I came across a news article back on March 9 about a product called Neurosky, which can allow the user to interact with a game using his feelings. Here are the Yahoo article, another article, and Neurosky's website:
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/070309/technology/us_it_game_conference_brain
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=19&entry_id=12483
http://www.neurosky.com/
I'm sure it will be a while before something like this enters mainstream games but it sure is awesome to think about the possibilties, especially since there is actually a working model now.

[Bobtheduck]

So, first up: I wasn't trying to be a jerk when I brought up the Spartan 2.0 thing. I guess I honestly forgot what their armor was called, and thought you were referring to the soldiers themselves... *stupid me* Now that I think about it, I may actually remember that line from Halo 2.

I will be playing whatever version of Halo 3 my friend happens to get.

About Home: I think it's great. It's like Second life only prettier, and not requiring it to be a, well, second life... The main purpose is a 3d chat environment from which you can launch games, which is what I'll be using it for. I also think the trophies have potential to overtake achievements, but of course I do happen to be very biased.

EDIT: oh, I didn't mean to post that yet... I've got more to say, but I'm trying to scan through the podcast again to find out what I'm going to say...

So... Since I'm a JRPG fan, and don't like American RPGs at all... I'd have to say my guidelines would be very specific to JRPGs...

Either time all events in case so the ONE PERSON you're supposed to talk to won't hold you back if you can't find them, or be more clear about exactly what you're supposed to do... My biggest frustration in worthwhile RPGs (see what I did there?) is when I need to talk to some obscure NPC before I can continue, and I have to search through every single NPC in a 2 mile radius (Seiken Densetsu 3, I'm looking at you)

Ok, that's all I got... This is one of my pet peeve in games. Every single Final Fantasy I've played up to this point has had at least ONE of those moments... It doesn't just apply to RPGs, either... The Silent hill series does this a LOT

I have to say I agree with "Let your choices mean something" and the problem in Final Fantasy games is you can't always be sure. Sometimes your decisions do matter, and you can miss out on things, and sometimes it's just there to scare you... I suppose the same thing applies to real life, though, but I'd love to see branching storylines as long as each branch is fully developed (Which is why I don't like AmRPGs...)

I guess I had forgotten about how disappointed I was with the lack of exploration in FFX, but I was satiated a bit once I got the airship and was able to explore the Omega ruins... Still, it doesn't compare to an overworld map. Lack of exploration was one of the things that killed Legend of Mana for me... I really want to check out Children of Mana and Dawn of Mana, because from what I've seen, they almost seem like apologies for that PS1 debacle...

Oh, that reminds me of #2 mistake for an RPG... World Creation...

Final Fantasy Tactics advanced and Legend of Mana both have a world creation system. It's really not a good thing, because it takes you out of the mythos of the world that it's trying to set up. And, in the case of Legend of Mana, it takes away any sense of exploration you should have gotten. I think in addition to needing exploration in an RPG is needing, well, a preestablished world... "Create-a-world" is not good for JRPGs...

BTW - So, I'm actually a Saga almost fan... I never played much of Saga Frontier, but I know Saga 3 on the gameboy and Romancing Saga 3 on SNES are two of my favorite games... I hear there was a new entry into the "Romancing Saga" subseries. I really want to try that... Anyhow...

[TheMelodyMaker]

I've so far only had a chance to listen to the first few minutes of this one. You guys realize, of course, that when I suggested that you'd be a "barder shop quartet" I wasn't actually expecting to hear you sing.

With that in mind, when are we going to hear you sing? (Just kidding. )

[jayquam]

Question to the Audience: What are your guidelines to a great RPG?

1. Hmm. The biggest thing that comes to my mind is how long the game is.No one wants to spend $50 on a game that they can beat in 2 hours, however,no one wants to spend 17 years unlocking stuff and exploring the world.

2. If the rpg comes out with sequals, make them different please. I have played megaman battle network 1-5, and really there is not much difference between them.

[Fish and Chips]

Bit of off topic drivel here, but I was listening to CAA Podcast episode 7, and Link, you said your mom walked in on you during MGS3 at the eye scene, right? The same thing happened to me with my dad! Ha!

And after refreshing my memory, I can actually think of a use of Eiko's Jewel spell in FFIX, but its still not worth the MP, especially given your other options. Shall I go into it for curiosity's sake, or what?

EDIT: Never mind. Me and Nate already talked about this and its subsequent failings.