Answer to Volt's "What anime would Jesus watch"

[Fsiphskilm]

I see wha

[cbwing0]

!Please Promise me you won't discuss it here...start up another Thread so we don't go off topic!-> The book that was thrown out becasue it showed significant evidence that Jesus was married... Shocking yes? But Not complelete false..there is a TON of evidence to back this up...I have the article and will post it later...please don't talk about it here...Create a seperate thread...in General or something.

[i]It would be my pleasure]

[uc pseudonym]

I wouldn't support that thread being posted anywhere, as it is asking for an argument. I'd still be interested in reading it, however.

I would make the distinction that while all Bible translations are 100% true (I do not literally mean this, but I do intend this in a general fashion), some of them are less than 100% clear about the original intent. All of them are an attempt to translate a message from one language to another, but with proper study the same truth can be understood in all of them (I never seriously consider a passage without at least looking at the Greek/Hebrew involved).

[The Grammarian]

Wise idea, UC. For those without Greek/Hebrew background, there are also quite a range of commentaries available. As John Wesley said, "I am willing to do: let me know your will. I then search after, and consider parallel passages to scripture, 'comparing spiritual things with spiritual.' I meditate thereon, with all the attention and earnestness of which my mind is capable. If any doubt still remains, I consult those who are experienced in the things of God; and then, the writings whereby, being dead, they speak. And what I thus learn, that I teach."

Another way to do things is to compare translations. You will find that even when one translation seems to be saying something different than another, it's because the translational method in the one was more 'dynamic-equivalence' than the other--one tried to interpret things for us a bit more than the other, in other words.

[Fsiphskilm]

[b]New World Translation: John 1:

[Bobtheduck]

I believe in different versions, butsome things (such as making us polytheists or changing it around so that God's a woman or that Jews are made out to be evil and cursed to hell with no chance for salvation or whatever) are not bad translations, they are intentional misdirection and heresy...

Volt, notice how I said there are not perfect translations. So, to some degree I agree with what you've been saying, but I don't agree that one translation is better than another except in cases where things have been changed to fit an agenda and not to gain higher accuracy. I consider KJV, NKJV, NIV, NASB, CJB, The Way (though I haven't read much of this one), the spirit Bible (again, haven't read much of it), and many other versions viable translations. They all have slightly different things, and none of them are 100% because that is impossible in any language other than the original. We take what we're given, because otherwise we just use our own intelligence which is a bad thing... We can and probably should study more than one translation, and notes and commentaries as well, and most of all pray for wisdome and understanding when we read, because that's the most important thing of all.

Of course, this is making way for an argument that I would be prime contributor for, so I'm going to back out of it for now. I've stated what I believe, and that's all it is.

BTW, I don't think it's fair to compare the Jehovah's witness "translation" to a standard translation like the KJV or the NIV. Jehovah's witnesses have a prime directive to contradict what Christians say and what the Bible says... If you don't believe me, just sit in on one of their church services or take the briefest of moments to listen to one of their "witnesses"

That second link didn't defend the Jehovah's witness translation, it was countering it...

[ShiroiHikari]

While we're on the subject, does anyone use the New Living Translation? So far I'm actually pretty impressed with it, even though there's nothing wrong with KJV, NKJV, NIV, etc etc etc. I think the translators of the NLT discuss their translation method in the front pages.

[inkhana]

We can and probably should study more than one translation, and notes and commentaries as well, and most of all pray for wisdome and understanding when we read, because that's the most important thing of all.

Actually, this is a great idea. I try to study both the KJV and I have copies of "The Way" (the one I use most frequently) and I think the NIV. The KJV is just sometimes a little too much for me to get on certain phrases, so it's nice to be able to fall back on other copies. I would think it would also be possible to miss the meaning of the passage working so hard to figure out exactly what it was saying...

[The Grammarian]

Volt- Hardly a fair comparison of translations. As was mentioned, the NWT is a Jehovah's Witness translation. As I recall from my brief study of its history, they didn't even have anyone who knew Koine Greek competently on their translation committee.

Better translations to compare others with are the New American Standard and the King James versions. (Assuming you can palate the 18th century English of the 1769 edition of said text--the 'standard' KJV you'll find. On a side note, it's for this reason that I always wonder about KJV-onlyists--they tend to be of the persuasion that it's the 1611 edition KJV that is 'inspired,' yet I wonder how many of them even HAVE that translation, and how many mistake the standard KJV for that edition.) Another really good one is the hard-to-find Young's Literal Translation, which is one of the most literal formal-equivalence ('word for word') translations you'll find. They have a copy at bible.crosswalk.com, I believe.

The New International Version and the New Living Translation are okay, although both are decidedly more dynamic-equivalence ('thought for thought') than the NASB or KJV, which means if you're looking for exact phraseology and the like, you won't find it, since it's been interpreted into phraseology more easily understood.

Ink- The KJV version of the Thompson Chain-Reference Study Bible is great for understanding archaic words in the KJV: in the back, it has a list of many of the ones you'll find in the text (for example: "meat" means "food," and in one place where it uses the word 'sith' in Ezekiel, it explains "sith" means "since").

Shiroi- I used the NLT for a long time. It was my first Bible after becoming a Christian, actually. I don't usually read it any more, having found that I prefer the NASB, but I would personally recommend it over the NIV.

[shooraijin]

> I think the translators of the NLT discuss their translation method in the front pages.

The NIV's translation staff does, as well. Despite the NIV's limitations, I personally got a lot more out of it than most translations I've read, and it's still the one I recommend to people who are getting started with studying the Bible.

[uc pseudonym]

I'm a NIV individual myself. I really appreciate that in their intro, they state that, like any translation, this is merely a best effort by flawed individuals to communicate something in a different language. That kind of humility is helpful.

New World Translation: John 1:1 - In the Begining was the Word and the word was with God and the word was a God.

King James Version: John 1:1 - In the Begining was the Word and the word was with God and the word was God.

Furthermore, any Bible with proper study notes would point out that there are no indefinite or definite articles in Greek, therefore the article is somewhat ambiguous. Of course, it is a Jehovah's Witness Translation.

[The Grammarian]

Furthermore, any Bible with proper study notes would point out that there are no indefinite or definite articles in Hebrew, therefore the article is somewhat ambiguous. Of course, it is a Jehovah's Witness Translation.

There are definite articles in Greek, however (this is the New Testament ;P). Just no indefinite ones, so the point stands. Divorced from context, it could be translated "a God" or "God." Context, not to mention comparing Scripture with Scripture, would indicate that it is properly translated as "God" (Ge1:1 "In the beginning God created..."; 1Jn1:1,3 "What was from the beginning...the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ."

[madphilb]

Don't I feel silly.... all these years and I didn't realise there was a JW bible (not that I should have expected any differently). At first I thought Volt was picking nits (and, sorry bud, I think he is somewhat)... this is what one group did to me with my NIV (pointing out, for example, that my translations talks about putting fertilizer on a tree and thiers reffers to human manure, pla-eeze). The above scripture from the JW bible makes sense in light of their beliefs (thus scripture is bent to conform to them).

I was searching on a subject today, and came across the [url=Blue Letter Bible]http://www.blueletterbible.org/index.html[/url] today... trying to find out more about them I was reading part of their FAQ, and they cover the issue of why they use the KJV on their site. It's a good read (go down to "Help/FAQs") on the side menu and then scroll down to the FAQs on the site and pick the one about the KJV, it's one of the first items.

In that section they cover a couple of things that we've talked about here, including the different types of translations... the not allowing which version is better to divide the Body, and the quote at the bottom that I like, that the best translation is the one you study! This is something I heard about excersie a while back, yes some exercise is better than others, but the best ones to do are the one you actually do.

[Bobtheduck]

(perhaps since this discussion doesn't look to be on anime any longer, this could be moved to another forum?)

[Fsiphskilm]

A good translation that was recom

[uc pseudonym]

[quote="The Grammarian"]There are definite articles in Greek, however (this is the New Testament ]

Ah, I have to clarify, as my original statement was poorly created. I meant to say that since there is only one type of article, it cannot be considered definite or indefinite, thus "a God" or "God" is entirely up to the translator (outside of context, etc).

[Technomancer]

Although it should be noted that tradition indicates the indefinate article. The Latin Vulgate (c. 405 AD) also translates the Greek into the more commonly used phrasing, as do later vernacular bibles. And of course, the translation to "a God" implies others, or at least an altogether different approach to the Trinity (three persons in one Godhead), it is quite suspect.

[Nightshade X]

Throwing us back on topic and to answer someone's question: "As far as i know there aren't any "Christian Anime" out their, just some that hint to it."

Superbook kinda comes close to the description of Christian Anime.

[CAAOutkast]

Jesus Is, was, and always will be Perfect, nuff said.

God Bless ,
Steve

[uc pseudonym]

Yes, both Superbook and Flying House have been mentioned, and there is another series as well. However, these are all just Bible stories animated in anime style, nothing you would feel comfortable showing your friends.

Though if a tenth of the dreams of people on this site come true, there will be a lot of Christian anime in the years to come.

[Vash is a plant]

I think Jesus could watch ANY anime and not sin... He may watch it with a complete understanding of everyone who made it and have compassion for them and call them to himself, to hold them like children... I think that he would see every stroke of the paintbrush as a piece of that person's heart and know what is really bugging them and the reason for everything, and have the exact right thing to say to each one of them... That's what I think. You don't sin by things you take in, but by what you do with them. The only reason it's suggested not to watch certain things is because

1. We don't want to approve of what's being done
2. We don't want to financially support something that's wrong
3. We don't want to willingly enter ourselves into temptation that traps us.

Anyhow... he could also watch what WE watch, regardless of what it is (even so much as something blasphemous against him) and know the reasons and what WE'RE going through and know exactly what to say to us and how to say it... In fact, I think that happens anyhow.

You are so blessed with such wisdom that it is just so incredible. Wow. What you said showed a completely different perspective. Just wow... wow

[Marie-Novelle]

The SUV thing... well, wouldn't Jesus need something to put all his diciples in? What better than an SUV?

Hah! Good point, though!

[Morluna]

lol, personally i think the idea of Jesus watching anime is kinda funny. it's just not something i see Him doing. but could He? sure. and all you guys have made good points here. i think he could understand everything about something by seeing it.

[starstoryteller]

They were all in a accord (heehee nouthing but word play ). about the bible it is 99.5 % Pure. That fact came form "The Case For Christ" By Lee Strobel. Jesus would like Miyazaki's moves ^^ because they are so sweet.